Emergency Management How to get a Budget

[TODD] And welcome to EM Weekly, this is your host, Todd DeVoe, and I’m here with Jacob Green, and we’re gonna be discussing a couple of different things. But the big thing is, how to get your emergency management program kind of funded. I know this is always the struggle for us in EM to have… to have our budget increases, or even to keep a budget sometimes. And Jacob is gonna talk about some successes that he had, and a little bit of some projects that he worked on, and just an overall conversation about emergency management. So Jacob, tell me a little bit about yourself, and how you got into emergency management, and what your role is now.

[INTERVIEWEE] Sure, Todd. And just before getting into my stuff, I just wanna say thank you very much for what you’re putting together, and thanks for having me, I think it’s so important that the emergency management community looks at these practices and the different types of programs around the country, so we can ultimately build bigger and more successful programs for our community. So thanks for putting together EM Weekly and this podcast, I’m very excited to be on it. My path to Emergency Management, basically, I was always interested in crisis management and public safety, I was a police explorer through high school, and then through college I was a police dispatcher, working full time and paying my way through school and really liking being inside the law enforcement organization, so I’m very comfortable in public safety. And as part of my undergraduate program at University of California Irvine, I was in Social Sciences, and I wanted to do something with public safety or disasters. And I had been doing some Red Cross volunteer work for many years, responding to different events. And so, I put together an undergraduate research thesis, and I called ten different cities in Orange County, and asked to speak with emergency managers, and asked each of them if I could come in for 30 minutes and interview them. I interviewed many emergency managers throughout Orange County, I was totally hooked, I loved the business and what I was learning. And then I got to interview, then, Fire Captain Randy Black at the Santa Ana Fire Department, and after the interview, he said: “hey, would you like to intern in emergency management? I can’t pay you, but I’d love to have you as an intern”. I said: “absolutely”. So, got to intern for him, an extraordinary guy, a really great emergency management leader in Orange County. And then I got a job opportunity with Fountain Valley emergency management, under Gloria Morrisson, who I know you know, and everybody in the emergency management world knows Gloria Morrison, retired from Huntington Beach; and she allowed me to work under her for the city of Fountain Valley, and learn about her approach of emergency management and her philosophy for a few years, which was a great learning experience, in helping her develop her program in Huntington Beach, though she didn’t really need a lot of help, but I just got to kinda watch and learn. And then, in 2005, there was a job flyer posted for disaster analyst in the city of Ontario. And the flyer said: “build a brand new EOC, build a new mobile command post, and start a new emergency management program”. And they had me at that, I wanted an interview; became the emergency manager for Ontario, and as I worked my way up in the city, I spent three years in fire emergency management, then I was police administrator director for three years in the police department, and then became the deputy city manager, and then assistant city manager of Ontario, and the emergency management program was moved back under me in the city manager’s office, so I got to play around in emergency management for a few more years. And then, after 11 years in Ontario, I recently left, and became assistant city manager at the city of San Juan Capistrano, which is where I am right now, and emergency management is one of the functions under me here in San Juan Capistrano. So, also in the process, got my MPA, master’s in public administration, which kinda gave me a little bit broader understanding of where emergency management fits, and how I can best support the growth of emergency management in the public sector.

[TODD] That’s awesome. Ok, I’m gonna take a little detour here, cause… I wanna talk about the MPA for a second, and I’ll tell you why. So, one of the things… obviously, I want my students to be listening to this podcast as well, and for those of you out there who are teachers, I think this is one of those things that we can use as a tool to enhance our classroom, specifically podcast, and things like this. So, I’m gonna use this as well. I like full disclosure, you know? So, I too, am an MPA. And I’ll tell you, I think the MPA degree is a really good, rounded, degree. And I have a lot of my students ask me about MPA vs. other degrees, and what do you think of the MPA vs. the other master’s in public safety?

[INTERVIEWEE] Yeah, you know, for me, in my career path, I knew that I kinda wanted to grow in city government and in public administration. So, for me, an MPA was a good fit. I will say that some really good advice that I got from a couple of city management mentors was that I should actually pursue an MBA program. And so I did. I looked into an MBA program, and I found that number one, it was about twice the cost. And as a new father, that was a tricky thing to try to swallow. And second, it was really tough. And those programs were… you know, pretty intensive, and I was interviewing a lot of former students, and I decided that the MPA worked better for me because I was working full time while I was trying to get my master’s degree. And so, it was a better fit, and I certainly don’t regret it, and it really helped me understand local government in the big picture in public policy, but I think there is something to an MBA program, and the emergency management master’s degree programs are also outstanding, if you’re really gonna be focused, narrowly in homeland security and emergency management, that’s an excellent way to go. But for me, I knew I kinda wanted to broaden my involvement in local government. So, it was between an MPA and an MBA.

[TODD] Yeah, that’s kinda my look in it too. You know, I know that being in public safety that a lot of guys went to those public safety degrees, but I felt that the MPA was a more rounded degree, and it gave you a little bit more… I don’t know, a little more insight in what everybody else is doing as well, so that’s kinda why I chose that. Thanks for that little detour there in our conversation.


[TODD] Ok, so, this is what I’m excited about. Now, I love emergency management, obviously, we’re sitting here in an emergency management podcast. And I know back in the 70’s, you know, we used to watch this TV show called “A million dollar man”… yeah, and we can rebuild it and build it better than it was before.


[TODD] So, tell me about your million-dollar, or maybe multimillion dollar EOC that you’ve developed.

[INTERVIEWEE] Yeah, this was really an exciting project to be a part of. Like I said, when I was hired in 2005 in Ontario, the job flyer said, “build a brand new emergency operation center”. And at the time, the EOC was in sort of a second floor… kind of a small room, but it had a general EOC floor, a little communications kind of side room, a little conference room, a couple of restrooms, a little breakroom. But it was very small, it was very antiquated, probably had been in that existing facility for 15 years or so, and it was very small for the size of the city of Ontario. 1,200 employees, 50 square miles, large community. And the city council and the city manager had the foresight, working with the fire chief at the time, to build an emergency operations center that could last for decades, and really could keep up with the growth of the city of Ontario. And so, I got to sit down, and one of the first things that we formed in 2005 was an emergency manager working committee. You Todd, managed those, and lots of your listeners manage working committees, which are just representatives throughout your city, all city departments and community. And we came together, and we built that EOC together. So we had the city provide the architecture firm, and we sat down, and every single discipline was involved in building a state-of-the-art emergency operation center that exists in Ontario today. And I can tell you a little about it, if you’d like Todd, because I think it’s a pretty neat model.

[TODD] Yeah, I really would like to hear about that. I mean, I got to work with Mike Rose and Dana, after he built his EOC, and I thought that was a great thing in Orange County. So, I would really love to hear about your process, and what you put into it, and what you did. But first, let’s take a quick break. And welcome back from the break! So, Jacob, let’s talk about your EOC and tell me how you did it.

[INTERVIEWEE] Yep. So, the first thing I did is, I took the entire group on a bunch of road trips, and we went all over looking at emergency operation centers throughout Orange County, Los Angeles, San Diego, anywhere that we could go. We spent a good amount of time in the city of Los Angeles, as you remember, they were building their new emergency operations center at the time, and so we crawled underneath their building in LA, looking at their stabilizers, and you know, looking at all the different elements that make an emergency operations center; brought all those back to the architect, and spent years really designing a state-of-the-art facility. So, we had things like, we built an underground storage tank that could supply a hundred disaster services workers for 30 days with fresh water. But the genius of the system that was built by the architects and by the city development services staff, was this big, red button in the EOC. If you hit the red button, it locked down that portable water tank that was actually in use every single day. So, it was constantly moving fresh water out of the tank; but if there was a disaster or an emergency and we wanted to isolate the system from the rest of the city, we could do so with one push of the button. It’s a pretty amazing system. Then we put in bunk rooms, because we knew that, as disaster service workers, many of us has to spend the night in our EOCs, and we wanted to have an environment that was comfortable, right? So we built bunk rooms. And then, we co-located the EOC with the brand new fire dispatch center, because at 2 o’clock in the morning, Todd, the people who know the most about what’s going on in the city are the dispatchers.

[TODD] Oh, yeah.

[INTERVIEWEE] And the best EOCs are those that are in very close proximity to the dispatch professionals that have the latest and greatest information about what’s going on with the city. So, we wanted… we always had a very close relationship with our police and fire folks, and our police and fire dispatchers, and we wanted to actually build a facility where they were co-located, they would be trained in setting everything up, they would be trained in working in the EOC, and we worked very, very closely and very well together. We had big 90 inch screens installed in the front, 40 inch screens throughout the facility, 5 conference breakout rooms for all the different sections to breakout; we had very huge storage rooms with all the food, water, all these kinds of things; we had a joint information center built for best practices for media management and collaboration with our PIO partners… you know, lots of different little things that we learned. We also learned the importance of not depending solely on technology. So we have race ports that move through the entire facility. You can literally take them right off the wall and move them to any breakout room, any conference room, anywhere you wanna go, you can move information around the facility. Every room has the same AV feed, or the option of different AV feeds, the different channels that come into the switcher. And we had an IT department under Elliot Elseworth as the IT director. He put his entire staff together, put them through tons of disaster training, and helped us build, and really become a part, a key part, of emergency operations center. The biggest activation that we had, for example; my first phone call? The IT director, to mobilize his team. And it was a really collaborative approach, built on best practices throughout Southern California.

[TODD] That’s great stuff. Excuse me. Sorry about that. That’s great stuff man, you know, the water thing right there, you had me at the water.

[INTERVIEWEE] That is a unique feature. It was development services and the architects that really felt like this system could be designed and put into place, and… boy, it really gives us the peace of mind that we can operate and not have to worry about getting access to other water supplies that we had our own fresh, clean, potable water supply. That’s pretty extraordinary.

[TODD] It’s pretty cool. It is. Now, for those of you that are listening that aren’t here in Southern California, water is one of our biggest issues, and I’m sure you guys understand that too. I wanted to talk about Ontario just a little bit, just to kind of give our global listeners, because this is a global podcast. Ontario, California, and Jacob, jump in at any time here to kind of help me out here, because… you know, I’m from New York originally, so for me this is a little bit from my understanding. So, Ontario, California, was at one point just this little, tiny, desert… high-desert town that got an airport, and they kind of just started growing rapidly, and then now it’s becoming pretty much a central large city, right?

[INTERVIEWEE] Exactly, yeah. It’s about 35 miles East of Downtown Los Angeles, it’s in what’s called the West End of San Bernardino County, just outside of Orange County, just outside of Los Angeles County, San Bernardino county is the largest geographic county in the country, and Ontario is in sort of the densely populated West End, and sort of the economic engine of the empire. Has the Ontario International Airport right in the middle of the city, it’s about 50 square miles, 175,000plus residents, and it’s a booming and growing community right in the West End of San Bernardino County.

[TODD] Yeah, I liked the idea of… I remember when I first moved here, and we went to the Ontario Mall. And it was like, this mall in the middle of nowhere, and now you go there, and it’s like: holy smoke, this place is definitely growing, so…

[INTERVIEWEE] It is, it’s amazing. Yeah, Ontario Mall has more visitors each year than Disneyland, believe it or not. It’s a pretty… that was our claim to fame.

[TODD] Yeah! I can just imagine that. Oh my gosh, that’s crazy. Wow, yeah, that’s amazing. So, man! I agree with you about the EOC with the communications… at Seal Beach, when I was there, our EOC was in the PD headquarters, obviously, and our dispatch center for the three cities, which would be… it’s called West Cal, it’s what it’s called, which included Los Alamitos, Seal Beach, and the city of Cypress were there. And it’s kinda funny, cause whenever we had a little earthquake or anything like that, the first place we would go was the Com center, to sit there, and kinda really… hear what’s going on, so you’re actually right about that being critical for emergency management, for sure.

[INTERVIEWEE] We, as emergency managers, as you know Todd, you’ve got a lot more years in emergency management, and more experience than I do, and as you know, not every program embraces their fire and police dispatchers. But without dispatch, and without the IT team sort of being behind and supportive of the operation, when the stuff really does hit the fan, emergency management will be isolated. So, I always tell new emergency managers: make really good friends with your dispatchers and your IT folks, spend a lot of time in sit-alongs in that dispatch center, with the headset on, learn their job, and they will start to learn emergency management. It will be a great partnership.

[TODD] Oh, yeah. You know, one of the things that I always had in my plan for having… when the EOC is activated, was having somebody from communication sitting in the EOC, a dispatcher would be there, sitting in the operation section, because they understand the broad scope of things. And earlier, I was talking to a guy from LA… from Cal State LA, and we were talking about the importance of the EOC at the level that you’re looking at. I like to say that the EOC is at 10,000-foot level. And dispatchers get that, and they understand command and control from a distance, where they’re not at the scene, they understand that. I really recommend having at least one dispatcher, communicator, inside your EOC when you do activate it. That’s just my opinion, so…

[INTERVIEWEE] That’s right. I gotta get a little credit out there, there was a fire communications manager named Gerald Polk, who actually happens to be the IT director now in the city of Rancho Cucamonga, but for 20plus years, he was in the city of Ontario, and he as a fire dispatch manager, was very innovative. And he was really the one who brought the philosophy forward to integrate communications and emergency management, and he always made sure that his dispatchers were a part of anything going on in emergency management program, and he ultimately played a key role in designing the EOC, designing the new mobile command post, and really supporting and building the program. So he is a great resource for you and your listeners, currently as the IT director in Rancho Cucamonga.

[TODD] That’s great. You know, as you know, even in Orange County, their EOC is stacked with a bunch with former dispatchers, and/or people in this area, and their EOC is co-located with their control one, which is kind of like their county dispatch, so…

[INTERVIEWEE] That’s right.

[TODD] Yeah, so… that is really important. So, let’s move on a little bit here. So, as far as budgeting goes, and I know that’s like, the biggest fight. We’re… as EM, we’re one of those things, we’re like insurance, you know? People pay for us, they never wanna use us, but it always seems to be that when the budget gets tight, they like to cut us.


[TODD] So, one of the biggest challenges in emergency management is the dreaded budget. So, how do you fight for that money that you need, and… now, my philosophy is, and this is my public philosophy. If I cannot justify spending that Nickle of the tax payer’s money, I won’t spend it. But if I can justify it, I’ll spend a billion dollars if I have it. You know? So, how do you get that money that you need?

[INTERVIEWEE] Yeah, that’s a great point, Todd, and it’s the challenge for all of us, certainly, in emergency management. I tell you, for me, it comes down to a few things. First of all, as emergency managers, we have to think about the broadest use of emergency management. In other words, how do we convince our city managers and our city councils, and our executives, and our managers that emergency management can be applied beyond just the big earthquake? If you develop a program that’s just centered around practicing and preparing for the big earthquake, you’re sending the message to your organization that you’re only valuable once every 20 years.

[TODD] Right.

Jacob Green

[INTERVIEWEE] And that is not the message that you wanna convey. Instead, what you wanna think about is, how can I raise my hand first, to volunteer emergency management to apply to every type of challenge or event or issue going on in the city? Let me give you a couple of examples of that, and let me just say that in my current city of San Juan Capistrano, and in the city of Ontario, I benefit from the exact same thing, which is a city manager that is 100% behind emergency management, and a council who understands, in both cities, the importance of an emergency management program. So, I don’t have to fight that, but I will tell you, going back to adding value, it’s about… you know, applying emergency management broadly. So, for example, our philosophy in Ontario and in San Juan Capistrano is “activate early, activate often, and come up with any possible thing”. So, if your community is having a large event, if your community is having a small event, whatever it is; activate your EOC. Start training your people, that: hey, this is a good way to utilize the emergency management instructor, the chain of command instruction, or try to get people organized in assignments. Use anything going on in your city, pre-planned or not, to activate. And then when you have the little stuff happen, you know, the wind storms, the tornados, the little hurricanes, the tsunami warnings: activate. Don’t wait and be afraid to pull that trigger, but actually activate, and show everybody in your organization that emergency management can apply to lots of different hazards and events. And one of the best examples that I saw of this… one of the best stories of applying emergency management out of the box, was done by a former city manager, Greg Devero, with the city of Ontario. He is now the CEO of San Marino County. Greg one day called me in upstairs to his office area; he had organized about 60 people from all different disciplines, inside and outside, around the issue of homelessness.

[TODD] Oh, yeah!

[INTERVIEWEE] And he called me up, and said: “hey Jacob, sorry I didn’t give out a warning, but I have 60 people in the conference room. I want you to walk in there, and I want you to use emergency management to organize this issue of homelessness. And we’re gonna do a large operation in Ontario, where we use the emergency management structure to tackle the issue of homelessness”. I couldn’t believe it! So, I walked in this conference room, I probably knew 20% of the people in there, and then we spent the next several hours organizing the issue of homelessness using the emergency management structure. And what we created was a 5-day, 12-hour each day… 5-day activation, in a level 3… or now I guess it’s called the level 1.

[TODD] One, yeah.

[INTERVIEWEE] That was tough for me. But get the largest EOC activation level, and the city manager understood that these concepts can be applied to lots of different things. And so, every car show, every major event, every law enforcement takedown event, everything that we could find in Ontario to activate, we did, and in San Juan Capistrano we’re applying the same thing. The city manager instructed us, last Sunday, to activate at a level 2 with the rain storms coming in.

[TODD] That’s beautiful.

[INTERVIEWEE] So we all got together, we activated, it was a great day. I brought everyone together, and it was about just trying to come up with any way to actually mobilize this. If you only mobilize every 20 years, or you only talk about using this stuff in the big event every 20 years, you’re just not gonna get the support for the funding that you need to support your program. So, if they cut the program, they’re not just cutting disaster management, they’re cutting all these very good resources to help lots of different assets of the city.

[TODD] That is so true, that is so true. You know, I had the same philosophy, and I used to do that a lot. I get some push backs sometimes from the command staff, going: “why do we have to activate for this?”, and I said: “because, at a minimum, it’s a great practice for a live event”.

[INTERVIEWEE] Yeah, exactly.

[TODD] All right, I wanna circle back a little bit here on this homelessness issue. Because, just to let you know, this is kind of my personal… I’ve been going through this whole process, after talking to some of my friends on the political side of things, and they really wanna declare homelessness a state of emergency. And I know there’s been some pushback from some people, and I understand the reason behind it… I mean, there’s some stuff here… money, right? We all know that once we declare things, it opens up money for us to be able to deal with the issue. And so, I kinda struggle with that a little bit, and I kinda came to this conclusion, that that’s actually a really good use of our resources. Because we do have the slow moving disasters, such as draught, right? So, I know we opened that, we declared a state of emergency, so now farmers and whatnot can get money to help out with the draught resistance, the issues with their crops. So, if we do apply the same thing to homelessness, I think we could actually use those skills, and like you said here, and Greg Devero, that’s beautiful stuff right there, because with Greg saying the same thing, applying the emergency operations, or the emergency management principles to homelessness is key. And again, for people that are outside of Southern California… I mean, I know New York City has its issues, every city has their issues, but… it’s really becoming a huge problem here. And if you drive up to 57 over by Angel Stadium… by the Hunter Center, and even going South to Newport Beach, you can see… it’s no longer just a few homeless guys, you know, camping on the side of the road. There’s like, full communities of homeless people there, and it’s using these principles to apply to that issue, that is key.

[INTERVIEWEE] You know, and he was brilliant, he’s absolutely brilliant. And what he knew is that emergency management systems should be used when you’re trying to get services to people, when you’re trying to organize a large number of people, right? And when you need to create priorities and put people into a command structure. And so, the challenge of “how do you get services to homeless in a community? How do you try to figure out how to address the challenges involved?”. He understood, and he was the only person I know of doing this… he understood that those emergency management philosophies could be perfectly applied. And it turned out to be… I mean, we did this action plan, we took over a 30,000 square foot warehouse, turned it into an EOC, did a 5-day operation there, brought the media… I mean, we had a whole operation to try to really organize this public policy issue in the community. And it was because of Mr. Devero and his understanding of the benefits of an emergency management approach.

[TODD] That’s great. That’s some really great stuff right there. Ok. So now, you’re in San Juan Capistrano, and you have the task of rebuilding a program; and I got to do that a couple of times. I did it at Seal Beach, and now I’m doing it at the university where I’m working. Rebuild a program from scratch… that sounds kind… “rebuilding from scratch”. So, rebuild a program or start one from scratch, right?


[TODD] Tell me about that process, how it’s going, what it looks like, and what are some of the challenges that you’re facing.

[INTERVIEWEE] Sure. So, the city of San Juan Capistrano, I’ve been there now for about 7 months, and I got really lucky to get this opportunity as assistant city manager in the city, working for an extraordinary city manager named Ben Siegel, who came from Laguna Beach, and really a star in Orange County. And all the executives are brand new, the city manager is brand new, I’m brand new, the entire executive team is brand new, we’re all brand new together. And the emergency management position was basically cut in January 2015, so it’s been vacant for quite some time. So, I came in, there’s no emergency manager, we have since been able to hire a 50% or part time emergency manager, I have a great emergency manager who retired from another city, and brought her in. And it’s really about doing an assessment from top to bottom, figuring out if there’s a disaster tomorrow, what are the things I need to put in place before tomorrow? And it all comes down to, in San Juan Capistrano, we don’t have the financial resources that other cities have. And so, in San Juan Capistrano when you can’t focus on the financial resources, and you’re not gonna get to the budget, to put the 50 inch screens on the wall and do all those kinds of things, is about the people. So, my first week was about serving all of our staff and figuring out: who was experience in EOC? Who was training in EOC? And then, my very first day, trying to figure out a chart, should something happen. So, a complete, entire focus on the people in the organization. And what I really learned is, at the end of the day, one of the best EOCs that I ever worked in, was in a parking lot.

[TODD] Yes.

[INTERVIEWEE] So, it’s not actually about the facility, it’s not actually about how much money you have; it’s really about do the people understand how to operate, provide services to the community, organize themselves, create structure? And so, in San Juan Capistrano is all about focusing on the people; you know, we did a fairly large exercise activating last week, in support of the city manager. And you know, continuing the focus on discussion and dialogue, and getting our people trained for any kind of thing we will face in the city of San Juan Capistrano.

[TODD] Wow. That’s pretty crazy. You know, rebuilding a program like that, and being able to take those challenges and kind of make them into positives, you know?

[INTERVIEWEE] It’s a lot of fun, you know, the human capital. When you don’t have the money and you have to focus on the human capital, it’s very rewarding. We have an incredible team, the level 2 activation last week went really, really, really well, and that’s another way to show the community and the council that we’re preparing for a disaster, and that these emergency management principles and approaches and programs are very valuable, and will pay dividends throughout the life of the organization.

[TODD] That’s for sure. All right Jacob, I have one more question for you… two, actually, I have two more questions for you.


[TODD] So, task and purpose is one of the things that we talk about in the military, and obviously, what our task is, and what our purpose is. So, what do you think your task and purpose are in San Juan Capistrano?

[INTERVIEWEE] I love that question, Todd. For me, it’s all about: I wanna be there so I can make a positive impact. I wanna work with really great people, which the city manager has assembled a really neat, diverse, executive team. And I wanna work together and make a positive impact in the community. I’m very bullish on San Juan Capistrano, I think it’s an outstanding community with great potential. We have some amazing development projects going on, we have great people, we have a very supportive community of city manager, and the staff that organization are building, it’s a very exciting time, working in the city of San Juan Capistrano. And my task is just to focus on impact and focus on working with others to make that happen.

[TODD] That’s awesome. So, impact and focus on others. That’s awesome, cool stuff. Right, so last question, this is the toughest one, I think.


[TODD] All right. So, if you had one book to give to an emergency manager, a new guy starting his day, day one as an emergency manager, what would it be?

[INTERVIEWEE] Oh, wow. Ok. To an emergency manager… oh boy, there’s several that come to mind. Usually, on the book question… if you don’t mind, if I can answer it, I’m gonna tweak the question a little bit.

[TODD] Sure.

[INTERVIEWEE] Great book overall, that is a required reading through California’s post and supervisor and leadership academy, LA county sheriff’s department to a lot of law enforcement folks, it’s my favorite book, it’s called “Man’s Search for Meaning”, by Viktor Frankl. It speaks to your last question there Todd, about purpose, and the community, and really ties into purpose… you know, everybody in local government, and everybody out there, should pick up “Man’s Search for Meaning” by Viktor Frankl. Great book. Number two, I would say, putting politics aside, and all that kind of good stuff aside, there’s a really interesting emergency management sort of philosophy discussed in Rudy Giuliani’s book called “Leadership”. The first chapter described September 11th, and takes you through… from his eyes, what he was doing from the morning when he woke up, all the way through the 48, 72h, that followed. And I think it’s a very well written chapter and a really good perspective for emergency managers to look at, and to study. It provides a really great approach. And the third and final book I’d say, is if you’re a new emergency manager, pick up the book called “The First 90 Days”. It’s a great book that will take you through how to approach your work place, how to approach new staff, how to approach your purpose, how to approach your work plan, and sort of what to do the first 3 months in a new position. So, I think if you’re a new emergency manager, and you pick up those three books and you read them right before you start, I think you’re set up for some great success in emergency management and in local government.

[TODD] That’s great. Thank you so much. All right Jacob, thank you so much for your time, and is there anything else that you wanna add to the discussion?

[INTERVIEWEE] Hey Todd, again, I just really appreciate what you’re doing, I really appreciate the fact that your audience is engaged with emergency management, what you’re doing with EM Weekly is very, very important for our business. And if anybody wants to get a hold of me, the best, and fastest, and easiest way to get a hold of me is my website, jacobgreen.com, and my e-mail is: jacob@jacobgreen.com, that’s the easiest and quickest way to get to me. That’s a very simple and easy way, and I’d love to help any emergency managers, or any local government folks, or anybody out there. I’m happy to take any phone calls, e-mails, and steer you towards the right resources and the right folks that can help you be successful.

[TODD] All right Jacob, I’m gonna give you a couple of seconds here, take as much time as you want. I want you to plug your speaking career, because I saw you on TED Talks, and you looked really good, man.

[INTERVIEWEE] Yeah, thanks Todd. I really just enjoy working and learning with other people, so I sort of been developing jacobgreen.com, sort of my site, leadership training and consulting business. It’s something that I love to do is share some of these stories, and adventures, and failures, and challenges, and issues with others; mostly about some of my own personal experiences. I had to drop out of college, and interrupted a robbery and got injured, and had all kinds of adventures, and it’s really about the lessons learned that apply to others in emergency management, in local government, in the private sector, and I’m trying to make some meaning and purpose out of some of those adventures that I’ve had in my life. So, happy to share that with anybody in your audience interested, it’s all there in jacobgreen.com, and I just really enjoy working with lots of different people on organizations, and hopefully others can learn from the mistakes that I’ve made, and some of the things that have worked for me in my life.


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